How can people on this board argue that Andy Rourke was not relevant, or did not qualify for 25% of The Smiths profits?

1.He was a member of The Smiths
2.He made up all of the base lines
3.Without those baselines the songs would have sucked ass (see Morrissey's band. The base player is terrible.)
4.Imagine what Morrissey's solo songs would sound like if they all had Andy on bass, they would absolutely kick @ss.

The only decent Morrissey solo song in terms of base was Jack The Ripper (and I think there were maybe two other songs that Andy Rourke did during Moz's solo career, but I can't remember what the names were).

If anything, Mike Joyce might be the one that is "irrelavent," though I would strongly argue against this idea as well.

I can't say that I don't hold somewhat of a grudge against Mike Joyce and Johnny Marr (Joyce for continuing with the legal case and Marr for dumping The Smiths). But, Andy Rourke, c'mon, give me ONE example, besides Jack the Ripper, that could ever COMPARE to Andy's base on There is a Light, This Charming Man, The Record Company Meeting, etc.

One thing I have come to realize in all this, though, is that clearly, Morrissey is the "good guy" in this battle. He has stuck to his guns (musically and in court). He never wanted The Smiths to break up. Props to him!

I agree with most of your points. I think Andy is a great bass player, but I also like Gary Day. Of the top of my head, I like the bass riffs in Suedehead, Sing Your Life, and Alma Matters. Billy Budd is good too. I am sure there are more. But yes, Rourke is underrated and a great bass player. I like Joyce because he was in The Smiths, but in my opinion drummers are a dime a dozen for the most part. Johnny is a genius and could never have been replaced.

have you forgotten andy's little heroin addiction that caused severe problems in the band? yes, he was a good bassist, but he is not innocent. anyway, at least you admit that moz is the good guy.

It looks to me after studing a book that Bass playing record producer John Porter both a good bass player and had worked with Roxy Music did Andy Rourke no favours in his musical development. John Porter being a bass player himself tryed to make Andy play in his style. John Porter was there for Johnny Marr and Johnny Marr alone. It took until the "Meat Is Murder" album for the lovely, talented Andy Rourke to really start proving what a creative and origonal bass player he is because John Porter wasn't around to mess things up for him trying to force him to play bass parts John Porter style. Andy Rourke was around in Morrissey's early solo career as well, Andy performed on stage with Morrissey, co-wrote three songs with Morrissey, was on Top of the Pops with Morrissey and was in a few Morrissey music videos as well. Of cause Andy Rourke was needed in The Smiths look what happened when they chucked him out things went wrong so they brought Andy back again because they needed him so much and the new Rhythm guitarist replacment wasn't enough they needed Andy Rourke back. All of the rubbish about Andy Rourke over the years fucking p me off.

> have you forgotten andy's little heroin addiction that caused severe
> problems in the band? yes, he was a good bassist, but he is not innocent.

What about Moz deciding to cancel tours at the last minute, and refusing to do interviews & television appearances whenever he wanted to?

> What about Moz deciding to cancel tours at the last minute, and refusing
> to do interviews & television appearances whenever he wanted to?
Isn't heroin illegal?

Amen,

Andy was crucial to The Smiths.

And, what the fuck does the fact that he did heroin have to do with anything? Does the fact that he doesn't eat meat (or does) change the fact that he's a critical member of The Smiths (or was)? No, it doesn't.

My opinion:

Steven P. Morrissey: Definitely the good guy. Never wanted to break up the band. Openly stated he would gladly play with Marr, Joyce and Rourke after the band broke up (which he did). And, then he got sued. It's partially his fault for being so caught up in being "anarchical" that he didn't have a written contract. (side note: for being such an anarchist, and flaming liberal, Morrissey sure loves his money. HIS PRIVATE PROPERTY. Oh, but's he's against royalty. Hahaha)

Johnny Marr: He like the guy from NYPD Blue that never should have left the show. He continues to deny himself and the fans of what they really want, the sound of The Smiths back. He's the reason The Smiths broke up, and he's partially a "bad guy" in this story, but it's really bullsh*t that Mike Joyce is now trying to sue him for the money that Morrissey refuses to pay. That's just flatout bullsh*t and shameless.

Andy Rourke: In the court case, I think if anyone had the case in getting royalties owed to them it was him, and not Joyce. Andy Rourke, as I've already pointed out is key. I heard he even dropped the case, and Joyce pursued it. Him and Joyce have CLEARLY moved away from The Smiths sound, with this Moondog bullsh*t. It's a waste.

Mike Joyce: In my opinion, he got hosed by Morrissey/Marr when they were in the band, but it's still cheap shit for him to go through with this case. He's the sole purpose that The Smiths will NEVER get back together. Thanks a million Mike!

> Isn't heroin illegal?

Doesn't cancelling tours at the airport have more affect on Smiths fans?

So? Andy might have missed a few notes. At least he bothered turning up!

> Johnny Marr: He like the guy from NYPD Blue that never should have left
> the show. He continues to deny himself and the fans of what they really
> want, the sound of The Smiths back. He's the reason The Smiths broke up,
> and he's partially a "bad guy" in this story,

Remember that the Smiths was Johnny's band. HE formed it. It got to a point were he didn't enjoy what he was doing anymore, so he left.

Why should he stay with the Smiths if he wasn't getting a creative buzz from it?

I hope that you're not suggesting that Johnny continue in a band that he didn't enjoy any more, SOLELY to keep the fans happy? As far as the money situation goes, the Smiths were a band who were going places financially. If all JM wanted was to make potloads of cash, he'd have continued recording sub par cover versions to keep SPM happy, and sat back & raked in the cash. I respect him for doing what makes him happy, and not turning the Smiths into a parody of themselves.

If the Smiths were still together in 2003, and were releasing poor material, people would be pissed off that they DIDN'T break up when they did!

He never said that the Smiths couldn't continue with a new guitarist. They tried with Ivor Perry, but it didn't work.

Maybe if Morrissey hadn't have been so unreasonable with his demands on Johnny, then Johnny would never have felt the need to leave in the first place.

I place the break up squarely on the shoulders of Morrissey, and no one else.

> Isn't heroin illegal?

yep, but the poor bloke was addicted. You don't stop to think about the legaity of what you're doing when you're hooked on drugs, be they alcahol, gambling, drugs, etc.